Tillandsia baileyi - hardiness?

Paul S · #1

I was talking with someone today who had read somewhere that Tillandisa baileyi, native to southern Texas and down into Tamaulipas in Mexico, is hardy to -12C/10F. Can this be true? Anyone have first hand experience ot observations?
Muchas gracias.

Paul S · #2

Looks like I have defeated the panel! Do I win a prize?

Stan · #3

I had that Paul for a few years. Then one day I noticed it was gone. Never found it. It was the striped type. City life.

nsp88 · #4

Paul S wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2024 12:31 pm I was talking with someone today who had read somewhere that Tillandisa baileyi, native to southern Texas and down into Tamaulipas in Mexico, is hardy to -12C/10F. Can this be true? Anyone have first hand experience ot observations?
Muchas gracias.

Nothing firsthand, but at least from what I can find on inaturalist and Google, it grows 20 minutes south of kingsville and the record cold for kingsville is 15F

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Paul S · #5

Thanks

I guess the final test will be finding it for sale and growing it.

nsp88 · #6

Paul S wrote: ↑Sat Nov 30, 2024 1:12 am Thanks I guess the final test will be finding it for sale and growing it.

This post got me interested, so I did a little more Googling and I saw something mention about Tillandsia being native all the way down to far South America. It gets pretty cold down there so figured I'd look on iNaturalist. Then that got me looking at all bromeliads down there. I was covering a huge swath of land when doing this search and I know there will be climate differences in the different regions this covered. None looked too high up in the mountains or too crazy far South, but I'm thinking there 's a lot more that have the potential to be cold hardy than I knew of.

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Paul S · #7

That is quite an impressive bit of web diving, Nathan. I have to say hardy bromeliads have been a bit of a side hustle for me for years and I would reckon historically I have probably grown (and killed!) a wider range than anyone in the UK. Back when it was easier and cheaper to do it I spent a fortune importing plants from Florida (Bird Rock Tropical, I think) and also New Zealand - a guy called Andrew Steens. Most died in my worst winter!

I currently grow a few tillandsias, although these days I find they grow better if I stick them in my frost-free greenhouse - even the hardy ones. I mainly attach them to chains and the whole thing just hangs up without taking up much space. But outside full time various puya, ochagavea, fascuicularia, greigia, a handful of dyckia although they are hard to come by here, even a billbergia and a couple of aechmea. Of course our growing conditions are very different so it would make comparisons difficult.

Anyway, I found a seller for Tillandsia baileyi online so have one arriving soon.

nsp88 · #8

Paul S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 01, 2024 7:03 am That is quite an impressive bit of web diving, Nathan. I have to say hardy bromeliads have been a bit of a side hustle for me for years and I would reckon historically I have probably grown (and killed!) a wider range than anyone in the UK. Back when it was easier and cheaper to do it I spent a fortune importing plants from Florida (Bird Rock Tropical, I think) and also New Zealand - a guy called Andrew Steens. Most died in my worst winter!

I currently grow a few tillandsias, although these days I find they grow better if I stick them in my frost-free greenhouse - even the hardy ones. I mainly attach them to chains and the whole thing just hangs up without taking up much space. But outside full time various puya, ochagavea, fascuicularia, greigia, a handful of dyckia although they are hard to come by here, even a billbergia and a couple of aechmea. Of course our growing conditions are very different so it would make comparisons difficult.

Anyway, I found a seller for Tillandsia baileyi online so have one arriving soon.

Sucks to lose so many, but I guess that is what it takes to learn. And if they can't survive your winter, I doubt they can survive mine either. Even then, finding the hardier ones that I could leave out most winter and only bring in/shelter for the worst storms would be nice. I guess I'll use your list of outdoors bromeliads as a starting point for that. The more I see of bromeliads the more I like. But I'm not trying to spend much money on plants and they aren't swapped here often, so I won't be acquiring too quickly. Right now I have a single billbergia I am leaving outside all winter (under a hoop tunnel) and several Dyckia platyphylla. I saved some of each in case they all die. I have two puya seedlings (I think) that I will baby until they get young, and Spanish moss and ball moss that I have indoors. I like the chain idea for those. I think I will copy that when I move these or get some of the more ornamental air plants. Anyways, good to know what works outside for you. A few quick questions.

Have you tried Puya raimondii? I saw "Crime pays but botany doesn't" post about someone raising them in West Texas, so they have to be pretty tough.

What is the most hardy aechmea that you have found? I fell in love with the orange ones in Kona. Wish they could make it here, but from what I've read they aren't too tough in the cold. Interested in others though.

And what about hectia? The ones in West Texas should be pretty hardy.

Good luck with the baileyi!

Paul S · #9

OK, here's a list!
Hechtia texensis is the only Hechtia I have - going into its first winter outside this year.
Billbergia nutans
Fascicularia bicolor subsp. bicolor and subsp. canaliculata plus a kind of intermediate form I have.
Greigia sphacelata. Keen to try G. landbeckii, which is toothless.
Ochagavea andina, carnea and littoralis
Aechmea recurvata, var ortgesii and var benrathii. Also the cv 'Big Momma'. There's a few others 'just' out of reach.
Puya alpestris, alpestris subsp. zoellneri (=berteroniana), chilensis, x ventnorensis, spathacea, harmsii, dyckioides, assurgens, mirabilis, couple of NOIDs, one of which I thinki is castellanosii. But not raimondii, tried it whenever I have managed to get plants but it has never established. I think ultra-high altitude plants in general are hard to grow.
Dyckia 'Morris Hobbs', 'Cherry Coke', 'Britannia', couple of others.
Edit - left out a couple of forms of Puya caerulea.

nsp88 · #10

Paul S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 02, 2024 2:32 am OK, here's a list!
Hechtia texensis is the only Hechtia I have - going into its first winter outside this year.
Billbergia nutans
Fascicularia bicolor subsp. bicolor and subsp. canaliculata plus a kind of intermediate form I have.
Greigia sphacelata. Keen to try G. landbeckii, which is toothless.
Ochagavea andina, carnea and littoralis
Aechmea recurvata, var ortgesii and var benrathii. Also the cv 'Big Momma'. There's a few others 'just' out of reach.
Puya alpestris, alpestris subsp. zoellneri (=berteroniana), chilensis, x ventnorensis, spathacea, harmsii, dyckioides, assurgens, mirabilis, couple of NOIDs, one of which I thinki is castellanosii. But not raimondii, tried it whenever I have managed to get plants but it has never established. I think ultra-high altitude plants in general are hard to grow.
Dyckia 'Morris Hobbs', 'Cherry Coke', 'Britannia', couple of others.
Edit - left out a couple of forms of Puya caerulea.

Oooh, I was going to just save the generic list you gave earlier, but a detailed list is even better! Thank you very much!

The Ochagavia are new to me. Beautiful - especially the litoralis. That cherry cola Dyckia is awesome, too. I am going to look up the rest tonight once the kids are down. Next time I am in California visiting in-laws I am going to try to track down some of these. So many more options out there (and often cheaper) than there are here.

Good luck with the hechtia! I've only seen them in stock at one place here before, so I haven't tried them yet. I saw them at a university plant sale but they were behind a fence. I asked about them, but they said they were saved for the next season's sale. The school is over an hour away, and it just didn't work out for me to make it to the next sale. Northeast Texas has really limited succulent, bromeliad, native plants, and xeric options. But that is all besides the point. Thanks a ton for all the info!

Paul S · #11

I forgot the tills! Tillansdsia bergeri, aeranthos and albertiana get through winters outside here. T. usneioides does but birds steal it.

The ochagavea are interesting. O. carnea has been grown here for a long time - over 100 years - introduced from Europe into the Abbey Gardens on the island of Tresco in the Scilly Isles. From there it has escaped and can be seen growing on nearby sand dunes and it eventually made it into cultivation on the UK mainland. It has proved to be pretty hardy, down to -12C or lower if dry. Then a few years ago plants raised from wild sourced seed from Chile became available and were different. A close look at the original descriptions showed that the new plant was, in fact, the real Ochagavea carnea and the plant growing on Tresco was something else. It transpires it is O. andina - very rare in habitat yet being successfully and quietly conserved in the Tresco Abbey gardens all this time.

I would agree that O. litoralis is a very attractive plant - the pick of the genus. Unfortunately it is the least hardy of the three (there is another species from Juan Fernandes Island off the coast of Chile but that is both rare and tender) and here has been damaged, but not killed, at -8C. Kept dry it would be better.

I have pics of all species, I'll update the gallery when I get a moment but for now a nice close up of O. litoralis.

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nsp88 · #12

Paul S wrote: ↑Fri Dec 06, 2024 1:32 am I forgot the tills! Tillansdsia bergeri, aeranthos and albertiana get through winters outside here. T. usneioides does but birds steal it.

The ochagavea are interesting. O. carnea has been grown here for a long time - over 100 years - introduced from Europe into the Abbey Gardens on the island of Tresco in the Scilly Isles. From there it has escaped and can be seen growing on nearby sand dunes and it eventually made it into cultivation on the UK mainland. It has proved to be pretty hardy, down to -12C or lower if dry. Then a few years ago plants raised from wild sourced seed from Chile became available and were different. A close look at the original descriptions showed that the new plant was, in fact, the real Ochagavea carnea and the plant growing on Tresco was something else. It transpires it is O. andina - very rare in habitat yet being successfully and quietly conserved in the Tresco Abbey gardens all this time.

I would agree that O. litoralis is a very attractive plant - the pick of the genus. Unfortunately it is the least hardy of the three (there is another species from Juan Fernandes Island off the coast of Chile but that is both rare and tender) and here has been damaged, but not killed, at -8C. Kept dry it would be better.

I have pics of all species, I'll update the gallery when I get a moment but for now a nice close up of O. litoralis.

8.61.JPG

That albertiana has a unique bloom from what I have seen of other tillandsia, and looks cool in large cluster photos I saw.

And you grow them all in chains? How do you attach them at first? Fishing line?

Beautiful photos in the gallery and all of the ochagavea! Yeah, those are all beautiful. Shocked they aren't more popular everywhere.

That's pretty cool! Maybe that will end up being a source for a repopulation effort some day. It is always cool when those are successful.

Have you tried growing ochagavea from seed? Are they fairly easy and reliable or more finicky?

Paul S · #13

I use narrow strips of old tights to tie them onto the chains (are they called tights in America? the thin stretchy things women wear on their legs!). Some are small enough to just poke the bottom end of the plant through a link - once they start to cluster they kind of grasp the chains anyway.

I've not tried ochagavea from seed - I know someone who has but don't know if it was tricky or not.

nsp88 · #14

Paul S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 07, 2024 4:53 am are they called tights in America?

Well now my wife is going to be curious about my search history, but even after a google search I'm not sure where pantyhose end and tights begin. I guess hose are a bit more thin and skin-colored than tights? But yeah it could be called tights. I bet either could work. Thanks!

Meangreen94z · #15

Since you guys already started this. Here are a few I’m trying out this winter. Only Puya mirabilis showed significant damage from 27°F(-2.8°C) and a hard frost. Disappointing. We are going to have colder spell next week.